Comments on South Belfast Diary: Rights and the Right

Hi Paul - it's not so much that he's authoritarian...

2008-06-19T21:19:00.000+01:00

Hi Paul - it's not so much that he's authoritarian, it's more that (as with lots of people I've met during my life) his concept of civil liberties doesn't extend beyond what might affect him or his supporters, hence my examples of animals and foreigners as being outside that. In terms of the intrinsic merit of the arguments, I think Iraq has turned out to be out of the frying pan into the fire, and in terms of aniamls, there's a big difference between accidental death and being hunted for sport (to say nothing of the effect on the humans doing it). But I know you are arguing respectfully, so any better examples will be put up as a P.S. on the main post!

"He did, of course, vote for the Iraq war. So much...

2008-06-19T17:26:00.000+01:00

"He did, of course, vote for the Iraq war. So much for the civil liberties of the Iraqi people, but perhaps foreigners don’t need them;
• He voted against the hunting ban, but again perhaps animals don’t have rights;"

Jenny the man may be wrong on a lot of things but none of the above marks him out as authoritarian at all. I mean this bit 'So much for the civil liberties of the Iraqi people, but perhaps foreigners don’t need them'. Are you realistically saying that Iraqi people had decent rights under Saddam? Come on. As to the hunting ban, well why should an urban elite seek to challenge the way rural folk live. Perhaps we should just leave the foxes to be run over on our roads instead? I understand the point you are making but the examples you include hardly illustrate it at all.

FG - Thanks! And Nick, I'm not saying Labour don't...

2008-06-17T21:54:00.000+01:00

FG - Thanks! And Nick, I'm not saying Labour don't deserve to be challenged, and I agree with you on deportations. I did try to find out Davies's record on immigration but it's not highlighted and means going through his entire voting record on TheyWorkForYou, but he's not flagged as rebelling on Conservative policy, which as we know isn't particularly liberal (no pun intended).

Maybe you can argue he's hypocritical in that he p...

2008-06-17T15:57:00.000+01:00

Maybe you can argue he's hypocritical in that he promotes civil liberties while apparently denying them to certain groups of people, but you could argue the same of the Labour government, who consistently harass migrants and asylum-seekers and forcibly deport them to extremely dangerous countries.

Your post has spurred me on to research my previou...

2008-06-17T13:34:00.000+01:00

Your post has spurred me on to research my previous gut reaction - that it was an act of integrity, regardless of party affiliation. The apparent hypocrisy of his position is striking.

Thank you for a truly thought-provoking post.

www - given he's done it and there will be a by-el...

2008-06-17T11:49:00.000+01:00

www - given he's done it and there will be a by-election, I think the Left should try to find a non-aligned candidate who would draw wide support and who could take up the issue in Parliamenet with more credibility. The best candidate would be Tony Benn, but I don't suppose he could be persuaded!

Nick - I always believe cock-up over conspiracy where politicians are concerned. Conspiracies come from unelected forces, IMO (that makes me sound very paranoid!)

WWW suggested on my blog the intriguing possibilit...

2008-06-17T09:12:00.000+01:00

WWW suggested on my blog the intriguing possibility that it was actually pre-planned with Tory leader David Cameron. Although Cameron is acting furious, the tactic has seriously embarrassed the Labour government, who seem unsure how to respond and whether to put up a Labour candidate against him.

I'm with you on this Jenny, his voting record smac...

2008-06-17T04:44:00.000+01:00

I'm with you on this Jenny, his voting record smacks his altruism down on the ground.
the one good thing is it has brought the futher erosion of civil liberties into the floodlights.
XO
WWW